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Post by supercop on Dec 8, 2017 14:48:33 GMT -5
Fukkk this shit.
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Post by nuthinbutdatruth on Dec 8, 2017 14:58:46 GMT -5
Don't know any of the details of the encounter but he was warned and he looked to me like he was reaching with his right hand.
US Supreme Court - We don't have to wait to see the glint of steel
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terry33
LER member level 6
Posts: 3,255 
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Post by terry33 on Dec 8, 2017 16:30:01 GMT -5
Absolute bullshyt. That cop had that guy terrorized to the point he didn't know what to do. With all that sudden screaming.Put your hands in the air and crawl to me? You do that and the friction against your leg immediately starts pulling your pants down. So the guy instinctively tried to pull them up.
that victim had no chance. How about just having him put his hands on his head and face away and slowly walk backwards.
im obviously not a cop but I've seen lots of cops handle much more potentially violent encounters without shooting.
A bad shoot in my opinion.
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Post by evp5O on Dec 8, 2017 16:38:05 GMT -5
The officer involved was fired for
violating department policy by
Modifying his personally owned
rifle after they inspected it.
He added a dust cover that
Said "You're Fucked" to the
AR15.
Lots of commands and threats
Being yelled in a short period
of time in that video.
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Post by dustoff262 on Dec 8, 2017 16:47:25 GMT -5
I'd like to know more about the original call to warrant suspicion that this person was an imminent threat.
Was this an angry version of "Simon Sez" with the loser getting shot?
Disturbing video.
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Post by evp5O on Dec 8, 2017 16:53:30 GMT -5
From what I remember the people in
the room were drunk. The male in
hallway was an exterminator and had
pellet rifles for his job in his room and
someone called 911 reporting that they
saw guns.
I think the officer and the deceased
were both only 24 years old.
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Post by dustoff262 on Dec 8, 2017 17:05:32 GMT -5
www.cbsnews.com/news/mesa-police-shooting-daniel-shaver-seen-crawling-begging-in-disturbing-video/The officer only had 2 yrs on the job. In NYC we get these jobs as unconfirmed. No one shot up to that point. No one menaced. Sometimes you get 2 people argue over stupidity and one of them will go to a pay phone and give a really detailed description of the other guy and say he has a gun. There is no way of knowing what bag-o-$h1t you have until its confirmed one way or another. I hate all the screaming detailed instructions. That and fear can lead to a mistake on both ends. If there was a much senior officer on scene, maybe he should have taken control. But its too late and lives are destroyed.
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Post by frmraux on Dec 8, 2017 17:06:56 GMT -5
Fired for the dust cover? ! Dam thats ridiculous. That sucks that he lost his job over steniling a dust cover. Im sure theu were just looking for anything to hang him on.
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Post by nuthinbutdatruth on Dec 8, 2017 17:08:04 GMT -5
Seems that they had only one officer giving the commands. That's the way I learned it.
The problem is in the wordage... Crawling, by nature, means using your hands and knees to move. That's what the perp transitioned to.
Knee walk would be a better word to use. Stop any confusion.
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Post by nuthinbutdatruth on Dec 8, 2017 17:12:39 GMT -5
Absolute bullshyt. That cop had that guy terrorized to the point he didn't know what to do. With all that sudden screaming.Put your hands in the air and crawl to me? You do that and the friction against your leg immediately starts pulling your pants down. So the guy instinctively tried to pull them up. that victim had no chance. How about just having him put his hands on his head and face away and slowly walk backwards. im obviously not a cop but I've seen lots of cops handle much more potentially violent encounters without shooting. A bad shoot in my opinion. You know Terry, you are right - You were never a cop. So until you've had the opportunity to be so scared that you see the hammer of your pistol slowly creeping back as you are screaming instructions to a drunk, possibly armed perp who is not obeying your orders - keep your "Absolute Bullshyt" comments to yourself. |
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Post by dustoff262 on Dec 8, 2017 17:17:16 GMT -5
Fired for the dust cover? ! Dam thats ridiculous. That sucks that he lost his job over steniling a dust cover. Im sure theu were just looking for anything to hang him on. What if he did modify his weapon? That's not the real problem. The real problem was what was said on the dust cover. That goes to the officer's mental approach to policing. He also had a poor performance evaluation with just 2 yrs on the job. |
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Post by evp5O on Dec 8, 2017 17:22:38 GMT -5
Skulls, swords, dragons and popular
sayings don't belong on your service
weapons. A few SWAT teams out there
wisely changed their team skull/dagger
shoulder patches.
The Punisher logo even causes a stir
these days and when photos of your
skull design show up in court it doesn't
shine in your favor.
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Post by frmraux on Dec 8, 2017 17:40:38 GMT -5
Totally understand what you guys are saying in regards to what should and shouldnt be on your service weapon in terms of sayings or images that might upset people. It does not give the right impression.
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Post by dustoff262 on Dec 8, 2017 18:00:30 GMT -5
Absolute bullshyt. That cop had that guy terrorized to the point he didn't know what to do. With all that sudden screaming.Put your hands in the air and crawl to me? You do that and the friction against your leg immediately starts pulling your pants down. So the guy instinctively tried to pull them up. that victim had no chance. How about just having him put his hands on his head and face away and slowly walk backwards. im obviously not a cop but I've seen lots of cops handle much more potentially violent encounters without shooting. A bad shoot in my opinion. You know Terry, you are right - You were never a cop. So until you've had the opportunity to be so scared that you see the hammer of your pistol slowly creeping back as you are screaming instructions to a drunk, possibly armed perp who is not obeying your orders - keep your "Absolute Bullshyt" comments to yourself. I have no problem with what Terry said. I don't agree with it, but his was a raw gut reaction to what any other civilian would feel after watching this video. Let your loved ones see it and you will find that same initial visceral opinion. As former and current LEOs, we like to see all the evidence first then form an opinion. But civilians react differently. They are more emotional and true to their feelings to the witnessing of a horrific encounter. But we should not push them away. Rather, understand how civilians react because it is they who will stand in judgement of cops at the next trial. |
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adam2
LER member1
Posts: 404
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Post by adam2 on Dec 8, 2017 18:01:01 GMT -5
I can see why that guy had shitty performance reviews. Wow!
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Post by 3train8x4 on Dec 8, 2017 18:34:56 GMT -5
I guess he didn't attend 'Verbal Judo'
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mongo
LER member level 2
_______
Posts: 974
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Post by mongo on Dec 8, 2017 18:47:38 GMT -5
The trial is over. The Cop was acquitted. The Jury's opinion is the only one that matters in this case.
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terry33
LER member level 6
Posts: 3,255
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Post by terry33 on Dec 8, 2017 19:08:04 GMT -5
I don't disagree with the jury's decision. I don't think the cop should go to jail for a minute for what he did. He made a massive mistake in the heat of the moment to protect his life . Totally understandable . He had zero criminal intent. But he was a lousy cop in that scenario.
Had this happened in a big eastern city and had the dead 24 y o been black, this case would have blown up like crazy.
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twohandspete
LER member level 3
NYPD Warrant Squad retired
Posts: 1,614
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Post by twohandspete on Dec 8, 2017 19:55:51 GMT -5
Little over the top with the commands. He had the kid in tears to the point he was becoming hysterical. Hysterical people don’t do well with commands.
The situation sucks from the word go.
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Post by msmajor on Dec 8, 2017 20:03:37 GMT -5
The thought I had watching the video was that he was probably following department protocol, probably learned at the hands of some gung ho instructor. They get their classes all jacked up and then send them in the real world where under pressure they revert to the training and it gets them into a tunnel vision nightmare. Personally I think the department needs to revamp training, and screening.
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Post by onthedl on Dec 8, 2017 20:11:32 GMT -5
I am a cop. I watched the video over and over. I don't know if the officer should go to jail, but I know I don't like the video. I understand that officers need not wait for the glint of steel. The officer did nothing right and everything wrong. Somebody's dead. I don't like it, and I'm glad he's not on my job.
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adam2
LER member1
Posts: 404
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Post by adam2 on Dec 8, 2017 20:50:21 GMT -5
I am a cop. I watched the video over and over. I don't know if the officer should go to jail, but I know I don't like the video. I understand that officers need not wait for the glint of steel. The officer did nothing right and everything wrong. Somebody's dead. I don't like it, and I'm glad he's not on my job. Pretty much sums up my sentiments. Some people just aren't cut out for this line of work. |
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Post by 62a4rmndr on Dec 8, 2017 22:01:23 GMT -5
Wow. That was a really really bad shooting. Wow.
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Elmo334
LER member level 3
home
Posts: 1,329
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Post by Elmo334 on Dec 8, 2017 22:08:03 GMT -5
I am a cop. I watched the video over and over. I don't know if the officer should go to jail, but I know I don't like the video. I understand that officers need not wait for the glint of steel. The officer did nothing right and everything wrong. Somebody's dead. I don't like it, and I'm glad he's not on my job. Well said. Couldn’t agree more. |
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Post by 40nout on Dec 8, 2017 23:10:41 GMT -5
This guy was in possession of numerous high quality air guns and had been waving them out the window of the hotel. Keep in mind EVERYONE out here in Arizona (good and bad guys) carries a gun. When I first moved here the Mesa PD lit up and killed several perps in the space of 4 months. It gets a mention in the paper and then it goes away. Parts of Mesa are really nice and other parts are a dump.
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