PJ807
LER member level 2
Posts: 877 
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Post by PJ807 on Apr 26, 2020 18:55:04 GMT -5
Do you honestly think taxpayers (and cops) in Red States where the pensions are FAR less (if they exist at all) should bailout the cops in NYC and LA? Here is another line we always buy from the left when they want money. I saw DeBlasshole interviewed this morning and he was crying about how the city needs 7 billion in relief and it is about paying for the cops, firemen, emts and healthcare workers. Cuomo said the same the other day. They are both looking to fill their budget gaps on claims we have to be paid but they will give away billions to illegals and welfare and homeless while not giving first responders raises. They are lying to the taxpayers faces. And the fact is the city and state already receive annual aid from DC for welfare and Healthcare. But not pensions. Still, in a bailout situation ALL of the expenses will be looked at. It's not our fault the city and state piss thru money with no room left for unpleasant surprises like this. But it's not Kentucky's fault either. |
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Post by Libwithaclue on Apr 26, 2020 18:58:57 GMT -5
"And the fact is that Mitch’s state gets more from the federal pot than what they contribute while NY gets less. Go ahead do your own research. I believe that is hypocritical on Mitch’s part. If your stare is the one on the dole then Do not criticize others"
That is not a fact, it is a lie. I have already posted the numbers. Stop spreading bullshit. If NY gets phucked it will be because of Democrat doing. Republicans have no say in NY politics anymore.
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Post by saturn4147 on Apr 26, 2020 19:13:54 GMT -5
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Post by dustoff262 on Apr 26, 2020 19:15:47 GMT -5
As long as NYC has taxing authority, it’s first obligation will be to use tax collections to fund the pensions. All else comes behind the pensions. Same goes for NYS. You beat me to it. The state has to open up the books and prove to the judge that they have no other way to pay for its obligations. And since taxes are the one mechanism at their disposal, the judge would order it so. The judge would also order a forensic audit of all expenses in NYC, NYS. All non essential expenses would be on the chopping block, not the pensions. Its not as if NYC hasnt been through this before. The last thing that they want is a judge to look at how they spent their money. I would think that someone on the Mayor's inner circle would tell him under no circumstance do you want to declare bankruptcy. If you do, a bunch of ppl will be going to jail. |
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Post by Libwithaclue on Apr 26, 2020 19:16:50 GMT -5
3 Reasons Why States Shouldn’t Get a Congressional Bailout
Rachel Greszler / April 19, 2020 / 49 Comments
If Congress were to fulfill Illinois’ request for a $40 billion bailout and provide the same amount on a per-capita basis to the rest of the U.S. states, the price tag would top $1 trillion. (Photo: Massimo Borchi/Atlantide Phototravel/Getty Images)
Commentary By
Portrait of Rachel Greszler
Rachel Greszler
Rachel Greszler is research fellow in economics, budget, and entitlements in the Grover M. Hermann Center for the Federal Budget, of the Institute for Economic Freedom, at The Heritage Foundation. Read her research.
Illinois State Senate President Don Harmon sent a letter April 14 on behalf of the Illinois Senate Democratic Caucus to members of Congress requesting $40 billion in federal funds for the beleaguered state.
Although the letter comes under the guise of unprecedented COVID-19 disruptions, the purposes for which Illinois and other states seek additional federal funds are anything but unprecedented. Opening the floodgates to federal taxpayer dollars to cover states’ self-imposed fiscal woes would only lead to even further fiscal recklessness.
Here are three ways that additional federal funds to states won’t help fight COVID-19 and will likely hurt federal taxpayers and states’ budgets in the long-run.
1. Congress already provided enough COVID-19 relief—states want unfettered funds. The Illinois letter makes clear that the state doesn’t need any more money to combat COVID-19. And, given the possibility that states are having to devise new spending related to COVID-19 just in order to use up the $150 billion they’ve already received, it’s clear that states have enough funds to combat the virus.
States have already received an unprecedented amount of federal funding, including both direct and indirect support.
For starters, the federal government has directly provided:
$150 billion direct grants for costs related to COVID-19.
$500 billion in short-term loans to municipal governments, including an estimated $35 billion in loan defaults/forgiveness.
$45 billion in Federal Emergency Management Agency disaster funds.
$30 billion for schools.
$34 billion for mass transit, community development block grants, child care, and election preparation.
But state and local governments will also benefit significantly from the funds that flow through to their businesses and residents. By keeping more workers employed, these programs will reduce states’ unemployment and other safety net program costs, and by raising income levels, they will result in higher income and sales tax receipts for states. Some of that indirect funding includes:
$377 billion in small business relief, most of which funds payrolls.
$293 billion in checks to individuals.
$268 billion in increased unemployment insurance benefits.
States have already received plenty of federal funds and aid for COVID-19. It is true that restricting the spending to COVID-19 costs has caused some states to squander the funds instead of returning them to the federal government (such as providing temporary pay raises and bonuses to public-sector workers, even as tens of millions of private-sector workers have lost their jobs and paychecks). But Congress did not intend for federal taxpayers to absorb states’ revenue losses or pay for spending unrelated to COVID-19.
A better alternative to granting states additional funds with fewer restrictions would be to remove existing unfunded federal mandates.
2. The money would reward decades of reckless mismanagement, including bailing out unfunded pensions. COVID-19 measures have been in place now for about five weeks, but states’ unfunded pension systems—the driving force behind states’ fiscal woes—are closer to five decades in the making.
Across the U.S., state and local governments have promised at least $5 trillion more in pension and other post-employment benefits than they’ve set aside to pay.
The Illinois’ letter requested $10 billion for its insolvent pension system—an amount that would cover one year’s worth of the state’s pension costs, or about five years’ worth of the shortfall between what the state is required to contribute and what it has actually contributed.
Having grown by 500% over the last two decades, Illinois’ pensions now consume over 25% of the state’s general funds budget and 36% of education spending.
Bailing out state pension funds would only prevent states from enacting much-needed reforms.
In Illinois, pension benefits have grown 900% since 1987 and the average Illinois public-sector worker retires in his 50s, receives benefits for more than 25 years, and collects between $1 million and $2 million in total benefits. Individuals with 30 years or more of service receive $67,000 per year and more than $2 million total in retirement.
3. The federal buck won’t stop here. First was tens of billions to cover states’ increased Medicaid and other social safety net program costs, and then over $200 billion in direct funding and up to $500 billion in short-term loans.
After the third bill—the CARES Act—was passed, there were requests for an additional $150 billion in unrestricted aid to states, a request from governors for $500 billion, and Illinois’ separate request for $40 billion.
If Congress were to fulfill Illinois’ request and provide the same amount on a per-capita basis to the rest of the U.S. states, the price tag would top $1 trillion, with New York receiving $61 billion, Texas $92 billion, and California $125 billion.
The problem with using federal tax dollars to fund state and local governments is that it encourages fiscal recklessness and causes states to become dependent on the federal government.
When Congress provided additional Medicaid funds through 2010 in its 2009 stimulus package, more than half the states built their fiscal year 2011 budgets around the assumption that Congress would extend the additional aid.
But instead of providing relief, federal aid to states has freed up resources to increase other spending. The federal share of state budgets already increased by 23% between 2000 and 2017—to federal taxpayers paying for 32% of states’ costs. Further aid, even if under the guise of “COVID-19” aid, will only cause this share to rise further.
COVID-19 is a public health crisis, not a pretext for states to request funding for things that are their own responsibility. Going into COVID-19, Illinois had only 42% of the recommended minimum level in its unemployment insurance fund, despite years of strong economic growth. And it had essentially $0 in rainy day funds.
States have already received more than enough support to combat COVID-19 and much of that support will flow through to alleviate their budgets.
Granting states additional, and largely unrestricted, funds would reward and encourage fiscal recklessness, and set a dangerous precedent for federal taxpayers to pay for an ever-increasing share of states’ budgets.
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Post by saturn4147 on Apr 26, 2020 19:29:22 GMT -5
As long as NYC has taxing authority, it’s first obligation will be to use tax collections to fund the pensions. All else comes behind the pensions. Same goes for NYS. Sir, do you have a Source for this? Pensions before bond debt payments? Very interested I found this reason.org/commentary/new-york-citys-pension-debt-is-driving-it-to-bankruptcy/But i wonder if 12k check and health benefits are also protected. And i gather this goes out window if BK is declared |
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PDU
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Posts: 1,291
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Post by PDU on Apr 26, 2020 20:07:40 GMT -5
As long as NYC has taxing authority, it’s first obligation will be to use tax collections to fund the pensions. All else comes behind the pensions. Same goes for NYS. Sir, do you have a Source for this? Pensions before bond debt payments? Very interested I found this reason.org/commentary/new-york-citys-pension-debt-is-driving-it-to-bankruptcy/But i wonder if 12k check and health benefits are also protected. And i gather this goes out window if BK is declared Its in New York's states constitution |
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PDU
LER member level 3
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Posts: 1,291
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Post by PDU on Apr 26, 2020 20:12:24 GMT -5
I heard rumors from a very high sources (politician) that one of the options is buyouts to get older higher paid workers off the payroll and onto the pension fund.
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PDU
LER member level 3
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Posts: 1,291
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Post by PDU on Apr 26, 2020 20:15:42 GMT -5
You guys failed to watch the video and get the point about pensions and no bail out due to fat pensions for public servant millionaires especially those obscene ones over $50k. Immediately any criticism of Mitch’s hypocrisy on the subject is an attack on everything red and a defense of everything blue and throw in illegals while you are at it which has what to do with the video’s subject? Over 50,000😂 mine is doubly obscene and I deserve it BTW |
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Post by saturn4147 on Apr 26, 2020 20:26:06 GMT -5
Its in New York's states constitution Thanks. Article V section 7 §7. After July first, nineteen hundred forty, membership in any pension or retirement system of the state or of a civil division thereof shall be a contractual relationship, the benefits of which shall not be diminished or impaired. (New. Adopted by Constitutional Convention of 1938 and approved by vote of the people November 8, 1938.) and if they renege or $12k Defined I guess it will not Be covered by constitution but by agreement unions made with NYC |
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Post by saturn4147 on Apr 26, 2020 20:27:15 GMT -5
You guys failed to watch the video and get the point about pensions and no bail out due to fat pensions for public servant millionaires especially those obscene ones over $50k. Immediately any criticism of Mitch’s hypocrisy on the subject is an attack on everything red and a defense of everything blue and throw in illegals while you are at it which has what to do with the video’s subject? Over 50,000😂 mine is doubly obscene and I deserve it BTW Mine is 20 yrs this June and it has been obscene for two decades |
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Post by meznoktoz on Apr 27, 2020 4:50:30 GMT -5
Was hanging out with an old lieutenant friend of mine the other day. ( yes , fuck social distance). After chatting with him we both pretty much agreed that worrying will put you in an early grave. Stress is a dangerous and silent killer. Good advice. |
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